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BALOO Training Question

In order to keep the Cub Scout Pack affiliated with the Scout Troop I have been involved with since 2005 going, I became the Cub Scout Pack Committee Chair when the man serving as chair basically said bye-bye without telling anyone.

Here is my question: If I completed the Scoutmaster training course, including the outdoor skills section, and I have helped teach classes on outdoor skills, do I still need to take BALOO outdoor training order to take Cub Scouts camping?

Not that I don’t “Love” my one hour a week of scouting ( grin). But I am already running a camporee, helping to run Cub Scout range weekend, Doing a merit badge midway, and still have to have marriage. If it is a weekend of Scouting training I can avoid, I would be good with it.

Eric Durr

Every cub scout campout requires at least one adult leader who is BALOO trained. IOLS is not generally considered a substitute for BALOO (in the same way that BALOO is not IOLS), since there are cub-specific issues/rules that are covered in BALOO that typically are not covered in IOLS.

However, you only need one BALOO-trained adult with the unit on the event. It’s good practice to have at least two, though, since if one leaves unexpectedly, technically the unit would be out of compliance.

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Like IOLS, I know of no “get out of BALOO” option. Your district training chair may be able to “help”. I recently learned that those who staff National Camp School get updated credentials for the class they teach. You could teach BALOO and I bet get the same. :slight_smile: It would likely be more work than taking the class, but if you could teach it, why not?


You need to have at least one leader that’s completed BALOO training to do an overnight campout for Cub Scouts, as well as two registered and YPT-certified adult leaders. Here’s the link to the requirements in the Guide to Safe Scouting, covered under the section " Cub Scout Overnight Opportunities"

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The BALOO-trained adult can also be one of your minimum two registered adult leaders 21+. I know that’s what @SteveCagigas meant, but I could see it being read as a requirement for three leaders (one with BALOO and two who meet the 21+ requirement).

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Thank you for clarifying that for me :+1:

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No. IOLS covers advancement requirements through First Class rank and safety, with a bit of the patrol method.

BALOO is safety and program of an overnight activity, leading younger youth and their parents through what for many is their first night in a tent.

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What if the council fails to offer BALOO in a timely manner? We have leaders with scouts that are aging out of our Pack upwards to the Troop. Our council has not offered BALOO training in over a year. I have been begging them to set a date for months, but the response has fallen on deaf ears.

This is much the same thing that a lot of units are currently facing regarding renewing/obtaining First Aid/CPR and Wilderness and Remote First Aid. Unless there’s a waiver of some sort granted, in writing, we’re stuck.

If you are fortunate enough to be near another council which is offering the training, theoretically one could take the training there and make sure that the training data is entered into your account by one of the unit Key 3 (and/or pass a copy of your BALOO card along to the district training chair for logging).

You should escalate within council. They have created the situation and you are stuck.


or take in your own hands - I live in a geographically large council - and us in the southern half usually have to arrange our own training unless we want to go 2 hours north. So for WFA I knew instructor and called them to set up here.

I like that idea better. As long as COVID rules don’t prevent it, why not! Offer it to at least your distirct and you are golden!

I hate to say this, but since I know, I can’t hold back. Things like BALOO require a trained Short Term Camp Administrator (STCA). So, you have to find one of those to approve and audit the training since it is overnight. If you have it at a council camp that is acredited nationally each year, it is more or less a papershuffel plus the STCA needs to make sure what is being done is within the standards of the NCAP standards.


Aim to attend a Council Organized event, then you can avoid the BALOO Training Requirement. Otherwise you are tied to the BALOO requirement for a Pack Overnighter.

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As someone who teaches both BALOO and IOLS in my own council, there is a lot of overlap between the training contents but also some important differences. Given your prior experience, there are some elements of BALOO that will seem remedial to you but I’m afraid there is no getting out of it.

I would, however, ask why YOU need to be the BALOO-trained leader for the Pack. As Committee Chairman, your job is to be the adult-facing leader of the unit. Your number one responsibility is recruiting other adults. Rather than take BALOO yourself, why not recruit 2 or even 3 other adults to take the training? BALOO can be a great introductory course and might sway them to take on even more responsibility within the Pack.


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