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New fees for 2020 - Membership Fees

Bottom line, it is the job of the national executive leadership to prevent these situations and to communicate appropriately. These things did not happen and it is a gross failure on their part that will hurt the organization for years to come. We may never know exactly how the mismanagement occurred due to the secretive nature they have had during the entire process. This again speaks to a need for us to reorganize at the highest levels, and in the process reorganize the pay structure. I am sorry if you disagree that the Chief executive is not responsible for the failure of the organization. It is a rare occasion a company fails without it being the result of leadership. With the 9M we paid our executives I would expect better.

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First and foremost: this organization has not failed.

I also have not witnessed any “secretive behavior” – instead, I have seen national and council be open and frank. All through this process, national and council have been letting us know that a change is coming, why it is coming, and even gave a date well in advance of when they would make a final decision. And they stuck to that date, providing details and information.

What I do see is people making accusations that are not true or at least that they have no evidence to support.

Leadership is doing what they can to navigate through difficult waters. It’s not smart commit mutiny because of a storm.

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I can’t speak to every detail of this, but I can speak to the insurance side (as an insurance professional with no inside knowledge of the BSA’s insurance):

  1. How much advance notice do you get when your auto or home insurance rates increase? In most states it’s around 45 days. The BSA’s insurance is likely no different.
  2. The insurance industry is really struggling with the impact of the removal of statutes of limitations. The BSA has no chance of quantifying that with any precision.

I understand the frustration with this, and I suspect the National executive committee shares your frustration.

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I can also add that spending many years as an insurance producer or agent as most would be familiar with, there are factors that determine rates for an insured. In the liability market especially if your contract is written by a carrier in excess and surplus lines, the rates are not market driven but rather than that on a claims reserves basis. There is little negotiation on the part of the insured party. The protection of the insured and insurer are the determining factor.

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Here’s my input: The increase is a huge deal that is make or break for a lot of families. Fundraising isn’t a great answer because everyone in the community has given as much as they can already to the infinite overlapping fundraisers every child is doing. I’m a single, disabled mother. I don’t have any extra money. I made myself physically sick doing popcorn sales with my children and ended up in the er from pushing myself past my ability because fundraising is the only way we had a chance for camp. The increase ate up the money we earned so we will be sitting out a lot of activities/go and sees/camp unless there’s a magic change. I and the rest of our Pack leadership have tried multiple times to find out info and get scholarship applications for me and the 7 other families in our pack that can’t pay and we haven’t gotten any response. Our pack has cut out paying for elective loops, patches, t-shirts, trophies for pinewood and rain gutter regatta, snacks and decorations for camp, food for Blue and Gold, and multiple other items from our budget that make the program memorable. I have volunteers shovel my driveway because I can’t. I can’t spend my weekends wrapping gifts or sacking groceries. If I could, I could get a job and pay my own fees. This isn’t about people whining or being lazy. I’m heartbroken at the thought of my children not being able to cross over on the bridge my father built our pack for my brother to cross over on 20 years ago. My family has put our heart and soul into our pack for decades now. National and Council needs to be coming to us with resources to help, not already overworked free volunteers to scramble and beg for. They say no scout will be left out because of inability to pay, but they aren’t giving any concrete way to receive those funds that put any of our minds at ease.

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I agree that more information needs to come out quickly with national’s commitment to provide support to those in need.

I recommend that each unit determine what level of immediate financial impact can be quantified and come up with a number… “we are $X short” or something that simple. That’s how we can best help units in need.

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Here’s another’s perspective (in this case a bishop in the Catholic Church) that highlights what has happened outside of our control and how other organizations are in the same struggle:

“The removal of the statute of limitations does nothing to protect children. But it does allow schools and other public entities to be sued and ultimately brings an unreasonable and unbearable burden on taxpayers, school systems and municipalities as well as the Church. Factually, in those dioceses in the United States that have faced the removal of the statute of limitations or similar legislation, the results have been catastrophic. The archdioceses of Portland and Milwaukee, the dioceses of Tucson, Spokane, Davenport, San Diego, Fairbanks, Wilmington, Duluth, Ulm, Gallup, Helena and Santa Fe all have gone bankrupt. And, the result? The financial resources for the good work of the Church are drained. Programs no longer function. Parochial schools as well as the Church’s much needed social and charitable services to the poor no longer have the resources to continue.”

From: https://bishopserratelli.rcdop.org/news/the-removal-of-the-statute-of-limitations-and-just-compensation

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At this point though who would you even submit that to? There doesn’t seem to be any set person or office dealing with anything directly.

Hi Shelley! If you’re talking about submitting “that” “to” someone and you mean the dollar amount that your unit is short, I would start with submitting it to your unit committee and charter organization. At least be prepared with a quantified amount. It’s not much for sure, but step one is to calculate how much you need so that when the information rolls out of who to ask you have it ready to go.

You may find that the charter organization will pitch in. You may find that some parents in your pack will pitch in. There’s magic in quantifying the need.

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Your most recent comment was off-topic, overtly political and seemed to be designed to create an even bigger flame war than is ongoing in this thread. That’s not being Brave or Trustworthy. Nor Kind, Considerate, nor Friendly.

Flagged the comment for deletion was entirely appropriate. Now you’re doubling down with passive aggressive name calling.

I’m asking you to remember also a Scout is Friendly, and start walking the talk.

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Mods, this discussion has careened off topic. Can we please close it before someone else says something they cannot un-say?

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I agree that this topic has run its course and should be closed.

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Hopefully we can continue the collaborative parts of the conversation working towards finding ways to help units meet their scouts’ needs given the changed cost model separate from the debate over whether or not the cost changes are justified. Those are, at the root, two different topics. The former helps our scouting families meet the needs to continue scouting, the latter (hopefully) asks the question as to whether or not there’s a better solution than simply raising fees to help the overall scouting organization continue to be viable.

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You do have a point there. Talking the issue through may help to come up with solutions.

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My comment was not off topic. The previous comment interjecting the politics surround the Catholic Church is off topic, if anything. My comment brought the discussion on topic by bringing into sharp relief the important differences between the organizations. I am not ashamed for redirecting the discussion back to the BSA.

If you want to police friendly at this point, you need to go back a long way and start hiding a lot more comments than mine. It would at least be courteous for my comments to be given the chance to stand against public criticism rather than hidden from view.

Further, I would not unsay anything I’ve said, and would reinstate all of it, unredacted, if I could. It’s 100% genuine and heartfelt.

I think it is time for this thread to be closed or locked. It has long passed the intended topic.

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If people here are concerned about dirty laundry being aired publicly, maybe BSA needs to clean its laundry up. If BSA has nothing to be embarrassed about then nobody will embarrass BSA.

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@ErinBrown @CharleyHamilton Any updates on how to access the Growing Future Leaders Fund?

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Regrettably, nothing from my side. All of the contacts I’ve reached out to have generally had variants on “we don’t know yet”. I got one response equivalent to “the fund exists, but there’s no money in it to start giving out”. The latter response is from one person who apparently got their information third hand, so I’m not confident in the answer. Sometimes, on things like this I worry that if I chased down the list of people who handled the information along the way, I’ll discover a giant game of telephone that started with me. :face_with_raised_eyebrow:

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