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Eagle Project

Like to open a discussion about eagle projects. We have several scouts at life who are going to turn in the application to council to start their projects… our first eagle completed his last month but it was really disscursation to him ( his first two were turned down it ) they didn’t fit in the primiters. My issue is nobody really explains what the primates are. Does the scout have to have a mimim admount of service hours, does the scout have have a project that takes a bunch of volunteers to complete ( while he mostly sits back and direct the project) does it have to be suntaible ( a project such as restoring or painting a 4 h building ) if show how does the scouts who do let’s say organize a drive to giver back backs for need kids or flood buckets for disaster relief do those…our coucil offers a eagle oration twice a year at round table and I have sat in on two but non of this information is given out. I like to offird a repeat of our first eagles frustration with our next three boys…even the eagle bord of reviews it seems like a big secret ( our first eagle is going to have his sometime in the next month or show when they scudule it. But as leaders ( and parents) who havt gone thruw this before what do we tell the kids…I am a Eagle Scout my self and believe I approve many of the things that the scouts have improved on in the past 30 years this is not one of them

I think the best advice I can give you is to have your unit and district carefully read the Guide to Advancement, Eagle chapter, and the Eagle Scout Service Project Workbook. Both explain the policy and service project process very well.

Guide to Advancement is here:
https://www.scouting.org/resources/guide-to-advancement/eagle-scout-rank/

Eagle Scout Service Project Workbook is here:
https://www.scouting.org/programs/scouts-bsa/advancement-and-awards/eagle-workbook-procedures/

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and where was it disapproved ? at the Unit Committee? By the Scoutmaster? At the District Level?

As an SM I help the candidates with their ideas when needed and they have to present to me before it moves forward. I help them with their presentation and point out where they need to be ready for questions and limitations of the project. There is no minimum to an Eagle Project, but if a Candidates presents it as “I am doing the least I can do” it will not get approved at most any level.

What are examples of the rejected projects?

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That’s we we thought with are first eagle, ( happened to be the scoutmasters son) that the scout approaches the scoutmaster he approves it and then the scout gets approval from council. I have no problem with that. The first two projects were turned down for not enough hours ( they want a mim of 150) one was redoing the schools sports placks ( the championship teams for the differnt sports football wrestling etc) I think it was because it was a one or two man job painting the years on the large placks. Second was a dog park for the town which the town wanted was able to get a grant for it ( if it was a eagle project) after going to several city coucil meetings and getting ok for the location that was turned down. It wasn’t the case of of doing least amount of work. The third project that was oked and done was to make flag retirement drop box’s. But he had to increase the number from two to 12 to get past the 150 hours. ( believe me he did great job having to go to surrounding towns to get places to put them ( our town is only population of 3000)
Our second scout was interested in painting a country school house ( at our fair grounds, he went to the fair board with his ideal ( they declined they are contracting to of the school house resided) but they came back with a need to paint the inside of the exhibit building ( and do minor repair work to a non bearing dividing wall. ) he ment the fair board at the building got measurements ( for paint and wood) and then went and priced everything. But now I am afraid if the coucil wants to see a bunch of people working on it. He may not come up with 150 hours. I don’t want to see him feel he wasted his time and the fair boards. I understand since he is a minor their will be adults their cutting 2 by 4s that need replaced.

Projects were turned down at the coucil level

@CraigVoss - as far as I know there is no specific number of hours, people or scope of work for a project save avoiding being an ongoing or present maintenance project.

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It clearly says in GTA there is no minimum of hours - but this sounds like a tradition thing which is harder to fight

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9.0.2.12 Addressing Common Misconceptions

  1. No unit, district, council, or individual shall place any requirement or other standard on the number of hours spent on a project. The Boy Scouts of America collects data about time worked on Eagle Scout service projects only because it points to a level of excellence in achieving the BSA aim related to citizenship.

https://www.scouting.org/resources/guide-to-advancement/eagle-scout-rank/

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@CraigVoss I would review the above link (and all of the GTA - Guide to Advancement).

On other items this is an Eagle Checklist that I modified off others for my Scouts. It hits all the high and somewhat hidden points

Eagle checklist.pdf (139.8 KB)

Eagle BORs SHOULD be simple 30-45 minute action - BUT some districts go a little overboard. Once you have been though one or 2 in your area you should have a better understanding and talk to other Scoutmasters.

Talk to your district or council Eagle advancement coordinators, but some projects might be getting rejected as routine labor or insufficient impact:

9.0.2.0 The Eagle Scout Service Project

9.0.2.1 What an Eagle Scout Candidate Should Expect
3. If requested by the Scout or the Scout’s parent or guardian, an explanation of a proposal rejection will be provided in writing, with a copy sent to the council advancement chair and staff advisor. It will indicate reasons for rejection and suggestions concerning what can be done to achieve approval.

9.0.2.4 “Give Leadership to Others …”
“Others” means at least two people besides the Scout. Helpers may be involved in Scouting or not, and of any age appropriate for the work. In cases where just three people are not able to conduct a project to the satisfaction of a beneficiary, then more would be advisable. It may be, however, that a well-chosen project conducted by only three provides an impact not achievable with those involving more.

9.0.2.11 Routine Labor
Routine labor is not normally considered appropriate for a project. This might be defined as a job or service that a Scout may provide as part of his or her daily life, or a routine maintenance job normally done by the beneficiary (for example, picking the weeds on the football field at a school). But the real test has to do with scale and impact. If “routine labor” is conducted on so large a scale it requires planning, development, and leadership, it may have sufficient impact.

9.0.2.12 Addressing Common Misconceptions

  1. No unit, district, council, or individual shall place any requirement or other standard on the number of hours spent on a project. The Boy Scouts of America collects data about time worked on Eagle Scout service projects only because it points to a level of excellence in achieving the BSA aim related to citizenship.
  2. Eagle Scout service projects are individual matters. No more than one candidate may receive credit for working on the same project.
  3. There is no requirement a project must have lasting value.
  4. Any plans completed after the project proposal has been approved by the council or district are between the Scout and the beneficiary. The role of beneficiaries in reviewing plans is explained in the service project beneficiary information sheet, “Navigating the Eagle Scout Service Project,” that is posted on the Advancement Resources page at www.scouting.org/advancement, and is included in the Eagle Scout Service Project Workbook.

9.0.2.13 Evaluating the Project After Completion
Eagle Scout service projects must be evaluated primarily on impact—the extent of benefit to the religious institution, school, or community, and on the leadership provided by the candidate. There must also be evidence of planning and development…

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Ha… 35-45 minutes for EBoR would be a rare thing in my district. They start at 2hours and go from there. But in no way shape or form is there a minimum number of hours or people working on a project. All of these things run flat in the face of the GTA. Sorry Washington Crossing Council and Mercer Area District.

Thanks everyone, doniven I think you hit a tradition that we were getting blind sided with…and thanks for posting your councils check list. I will pass it on to my other leaders and add what we do. As I said my eagle was 30 years ago, we had no board of reviews at the council level and I know I didn’t contact anybody except my scoutmaster about a eagle project, ( rather he had to get the ok from council or not I do not know ( FYI I am sitting 100 yards from it it was refurbishing a pew from our church 100 years ago can’t remember how many hours I did but know only help I had was moving it to my parents basement to do the work) I have know problem with more scouts showing leadership working with others today it just wasn’t explained good to us…so how the topical questions asked in a board , I know when doing boards for my younger scouts at tenderfoot they are nerves but we can and do explain who they are meeting and what we will be talking about. With with my older kids when I ask about the formate at council level it’s like another tradition they don’t want the kids to know ahead of time. We have been talking with other scoutmasters and one is coming in next couple of weeks to talk to the leaders and our scout who will have his board sometime in a month or so.

A Scout shouldn’t ever be worried about sitting on a Board of Review – even for their Eagle rank. If they are, then the adults on the board are not doing a good job.

The bottom line with all BORs is that the Scout has already done the work and met the requirements. The Board is an opportunity for the adults to get feedback about how to make the program better, and for the Scout to reflect on what they’ve achieved. In my experience, the second item is the more important of the two; young people (even “old” young people at 17 or 18 years old) don’t have the life experience to know that some times they should stop, consider what they’ve done, and take time to feel proud of their achievements.

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Has a District Chair for advancement I would volunteer to be on the advancement committee and work to change the “tradition”. without a change in leadership nothing changes. when you are on the committee and something like your issues come up ask “where is this in the Guide to Advancement”.

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That’s is probably the answer, and I really shouldn’t be surprised our second year at a merit badge college one of our committee members and parents who drove said he would be willing to sit in on scoutmaster training, after wards because of the comment told to him by in truster he just wasted his day ( because he is committe not
scoutmaster) basically he made it clear he would never go to another training ( I guess I was lucky when we first charted we had the scout master and me( as one of the 3 requment committee members instead of asst sm on paper) that they never asked what I did in the troop) to me I think everyone if they have a chance should take scout master training

I agree with several good responses already but agree this occurs everywhere. It seems like a tradition thing that has morphed beyond what the stated requirements are because someone wasn’t comfortable with a non-quantitative requirement. It must be meaningful and allows the scout to demonstrate leadership, seemingly beyond what he might do at a troop meeting. Engage with the advancement committee or others in the district and try to get some level headed assessment of what’s being asked for outside the requirements. I’ve also find recently trained adults to be helpful in these situations so seek out Woodbadge or NYLT experienced adults;

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